A conversation with Dept. Q’s executive producer Rob Bullock, writer and director Scott Frank and actors Matthew Goode, Alexej Manvelov, Kate Dickie and Leah Byrne
Transcript of the 1-hour discussion panel at the Bloody Scotland literary festival in Stirling – Sep 20, 2026
Rob Bullock
Hello everyone and welcome. My name is Rob Bullock. I’m the executive producer of Dept. Q and two years ago I was at Bloody Scotland and I was talking to Bob McDevitt, the organiser, and telling him how much I loved it. And he said, well, if you get a second season of Dept. Q, maybe you could come back and talk about it. So I am doubly delighted to be sat here with you all today. Some introductions. Writer, director extraordinaire: Scott Frank. And our wonderful cast: Alexej Manvelov. Matthew Goode, Leah Byrne and Kate Dickie.
So, I’m going to start with a very quick thank you. We are 15 weeks into a 20-week shoot. It’s long and gruelling hours. We are actually in the middle of night shoots as well. So I want to thank the assembled for giving up one of their precious days off. So thank you very much.
So Scott, let’s start with you. How did you find Jussi’s books? What caught your eye?
Scott Frank
Jussi sent me his book. And it caught my eye with the bottle he sent with it. And I read the first book, the one that we based the last season on, and I thought it was terrific. And he said to me, if you want it, you can have it, you can have all of them. He said, at the time, this was 15 years ago… And he said, ‘I’m going to be writing, I’m on book four’, I think he was on, or five, something like that. Now, how many has he written? Ten? That’s how long it takes for me.
But he gave me the book and I loved it because what I really liked about it was a situation I’d not seen before in terms of a mystery. Looking for somebody who for four years has been hidden away and nobody— Everyone thinks she’s dead and she’s also in this extreme situation. And so it felt a bit like a horror story as much as a mystery, and I loved that. I just loved it.
And I loved the character of Carl. I thought there was a terrific idea there and his non-relationship with everyone around him I thought was terrific. And so that’s sort of the initial [story].
Rob Bullock
So that was 15 years ago. Can you talk us through how you got from there to it landing on Netflix in 2025?
Scott Frank
So in 2019, I had tried to get it made various times. I wasn’t actually going to write it or direct it myself. I had made a movie called A Walk Among the Tombstones, and a critic had said in one of them, why does Scott Frank hate women? And so I thought, you know, I don’t think I’m going to do another ‘woman in peril’ story ever.
And so I was going to find someone that I could mentor and work with. And we wrote one script way back. He wrote a script that took place in Boston and we didn’t get very far. And I was distracted doing other things. And I was shooting a limited series in Berlin in 2019 when I got an e-mail from Rob Bullock saying, ‘I’ve been trying to get the rights to these novels, but the author tells me I have to talk to you. I wonder if you’d be willing to talk about it and maybe I could help you with it. I’m a producer at Left Bank. We make The Crown and some other shows that I’d heard of. Can I come see you?’
And I thought, he’s never going to fly to Berlin. Being American, I think flying anywhere, another country, is really far away. So I just said, sure, you can come talk, but just know we’re in pre-production right now and I’m not sure how much time I have. And he said, I’ll be there on Monday or whatever it was. And we had a conversation and Rob said, why don’t you let me handle everything? Why don’t you let us… We’ll find a British writer you could work with and collaborate with, and we’ll set it somewhere in Britain.
And then the next conversation was, what do you think about Edinburgh? And I said, I’ve never been. And then I went there and I think I pretty much got out of the van, looked around and said, this is where we’re gonna shoot. I love it here. It’s old and modern somehow at the same time. And unlike other places where you have that mixture, they look like two separate things. But there’s a real interesting blend here, and psychologically I think that’s very interesting. And that’s how it happened. So truthfully, the show wouldn’t have happened if Rob wasn’t such a pest in 2019.
Rob Bullock
He said he was prepping a show about chess, and I thought, oh, who’s going to watch that?
Scott Frank
I was thinking the same thing, actually.
Rob Bullock
So let’s talk to you about casting. Scott, do you write with actors in mind? I mean, how did you come across this lovely lot?
Scott Frank
Well, usually, especially with movies in the past, I write with dead actors in mind, because then you’re not disappointed. But in this case, I wasn’t really thinking about it.
And I had worked with Matthew before. The first film I directed 20 years ago, I worked with Matthew. And the thing about Matthew Goode is everyone thinks he’s this posh bloke. He’s not this posh bloke, he’s this yo-yo in a knit cap. Likes a good beer. Likes to hang out, and I had cast him as an American, as a Kansas City thug in a movie I did called The Lookout, and he was amazing. And this was right after he did Match Point. And so Matthew seemed— Also, Matthew can be irascible, and is very funny…
Matthew Goode
You’re really selling me here.
Scott Frank
And it seemed like a great fit. And for the rest of these people, Kate Dickie is a national treasure, is she not? So Kate Dickie… I thought, if she’ll do it… I don’t think she’ll wanna do it. She’s probably too busy doing other things. But I just immediately… I wrote it for Kate in my head as we started to go along, because we cast you very early.
Leah… I saw a tape of Leah I’d been looking at. There were about 50 tapes to look at, all these tapes that the casting director was going through. When I saw Leah’s audition, I stopped looking. I just went, this is it. Look at that face. Listen to that voice. This is an amazing, amazing creature. I want her. And there was some conversation.
Not in that way! We have to sit two people apart. Per HR at Netflix.
Kate Dickie
[to Leah] I’ll protect you.
Scott Frank
There was some conversation about, well, maybe you could get somebody better known. And I’m going, she’s going to be super well known after this show. And we should grab her.
Alexej, a.k.a. Mr. Universe, sexy man. It was pretty much the same story. I saw his audition. I wasn’t quite sure how I wanted to go because I knew the character was going to be different from the book in many ways. And I’m looking at tapes. Up comes Omar Sharif. And it was, again, a very, very easy, easy decision.
And I feel, every day on the set, I feel incredibly lucky, because not only are they each really individual and special and unique, they’re also racehorses. They’re also great, great actors. And so we get to play around, and casting for me is 90% of my job as a director. If you get casting wrong, it’s really hard. If you get it right, it’s really, really easy. It’s just managing their fucking temperaments.
Rob Bullock
Okay, so next question. So, racehorses. Do you remember, this is a question for all of you and each of you. So do you remember when you got the call from Scott and what were your expectations? Alexej, why don’t we start with you?
Alexej Manvelov
Yeah, I remember very well. I was very nervous. They told me… I sent in the tape and then my agent told me, well, Scott Frank is going to call you, this time and that time. And I remember I just prepared for any contingency. I had post-its around my computer, in case he asked me.
Scott Frank
He still acts that way. There are post-its around the camera.
Alexej Manvelov
Don’t reveal the trick. Yeah, but all he did was just talk for 15 minutes without any pause. And then he said, I just wanted to let you know you got the job. And I was so happy, and I couldn’t believe it. I had to pinch myself.
Yeah, so, screw the post-its. And I called my agent and told her we got the job. So yeah, I remember it very well as one of the…
Rob Bullock
Matthew.
Matthew Goode
Yeah, I mean, I got sent the scripts by Joel, who’s been my agent and is now your agent, and he actually came to Winnipeg when Scott and I first worked together about 20 years ago. And I read through, and I was like, and it reminded me of that moment because I read it, and I was like, the dialogue is so good, and this Carl character is outrageous.
Scott Frank
It’s like looking in the mirror.
Matthew Goode
It’s like looking in the mirror, as you said, so irascible. But also you sort of know that you’re really interested because… You know, I try not to start doing the character before I’ve read the scripts, but with Carl, I already started trying him on for size.
Anyway, so then we eventually spoke and I suppose you were sort of gauging my interest. And it’s not like I get offered these kind of things all the time. So I was like, yeah, I’m super interested. Are you mad? And 10 books as well. Super interested. You’d be a fucking madman not to be interested.
But the quality of what you’re setting up, obviously, you could see it was going to be a really good thing. But then, and this is the really good thing, you were like, I’m going to have to bat for you. It’s not going to be… I’m going to have to convince Left Bank who you’ve worked with before.
Scott Frank
And therefore will be tough to convince.
Matthew Goode
And so luckily you did, and then luckily it came my way. So I was very, very, very grateful. And let’s hope we don’t mess up season 2. Cheers. Leah Byrne.
Leah Byrne
Hello. Yeah, mine was quite similar to Alexej. It was just… I very purposely didn’t google who Scott was beforehand, so I was just meeting a guy on the internet.
Kate Dickie
The story continues.
Matthew Goode
Any normal Friday night.
Leah Byrne
But yeah, I got the same kind of, at the end of the call, being like, you’re my first choice for the part, so obviously I’m freaking out.
My agent’s very much got her feet on the ground and she’s like, let’s just see, let’s just wait till we get the official green light. So I waited about a month after that and then got the phone call and I was rehearsing a show at the Tron Theatre in Glasgow and they’ve got like a green room that’s right next to kind of like the admin offices, so there’s always people in the building.
And I got the phone call and so I went out to the corridor to take the phone call and this was like, what, three years ago? And I bumped into a few people who still work in the admin office recently, and they were like, we were just talking the other day about when you found out you got Dept. Q, because we were just working away, then we heard this almighty fucking scream. I was like [screams]. So it was a good day, yeah.
Rob Bullock
Kate.
Kate Dickie
So I did know who Scott was, because I watched Queen’s Gambit like three times. Three times in a row, I got completely obsessed and I remember phoning my agent like laughing and being like, oh my god, if I could ever work with Scott Frank, I’d die happy. So I could die any time now. But in that way that you say, of course it’ll never happen. How on earth would I ever work with Scott? It’s just not a possibility, but this is what I’d said.
So then a couple of years later, she phoned and I think she must have forgotten the conversation. She said, oh, there’s a director called Scott Frank wanting a call and I was like, Scott Frank? Scott Frank from, like, the Queen’s Gambit Scott Frank? Or is there another Scott Frank?
And then we had a really beautiful chat and I loved that Moira was being made a woman because she’s a guy in the books and we talked about that and it was like a dream. I felt I’d manifested you into my life, so…
Matthew Goode
But weirdly in the most pessimistic way. Which is so much more interesting than lighting a candle for someone.
Rob Bullock
So I’ve got another question for each of you, which is: During filming, was there a moment where you just went, ah, this is my character? And if so, when was it?
Kate Dickie
I don’t mind going first. Mine was when Moira has that argument with Carl in episode 5, or we’re always arguing actually, so one of them, a discussion, and you’re asking me or, you know, arguing about why I’d made decisions about Bruce Logan and who was in charge of the thing.
And Moira talks about being a woman and being the first woman in this job, and not just doing it for me, but doing it for who comes after her. And for me, that’s the kind of like a real crux of Moira for me. It was the way that explains, you know, some of our decision making. It also just gave you a really good kind of insight in her being a woman in a man’s world and the sort of things that she’ll have had to work twice as hard at and the responsibility of not just being about what’s good for me and how would I get promotions and how would this work as a team. It’s also like I’m laying a path for people after me. So I really loved that. That was the very, like, the crux of Moira, for me anyway.
Rob Bullock
Leah.
Leah Byrne
I think maybe there’s one scene I always come back to, and I think I remember it the most on set, was it was the first day I filmed with Jamie Sives, who plays Hardy, and I visit him in hospital and I start crying and all of that. And I was really nervous because I love Jamie. But I remember being really proud of it after we’d finished it because I think it’s a great scene for Rose and that she’s not afraid to be emotional and we see this gorgeous dynamic she has with Hardy.
But it’s like the first moment where we start to see her, she gets the confidence to go off and do her own thing. And the rest of that episode is her going to more and investigating and being amazing. Yeah, I think you get the full scope of what Rose is capable of.
Alexej Manvelov
Matthew.
Matthew Goode
I’m still thinking about it.
Rob Bullock
Alexej.
Scott Frank
Even while we’re shooting, trust me.
Alexej Manvelov
Yeah, I’m still thinking. Doesn’t help. So for me, it was every scene with Carl, like in the first episode, but the one is where he has a panic attack and Akram is finally above him.
Matthew Goode
Rehearsals sucked.
Alexej Manvelov
That was for me. I mean, but it kind of revealed who Akram really is. So that’s the scene, yeah.
Rob Bullock
Matthew. Are we there yet?
Matthew Goode
I’m still thinking.
Kate Dickie
You’ve got so many to choose from.
Matthew Goode
I mean, it was such a strange thing, the first season, because, you know, you’re sort of instantly… I mean, very strange when you read the first script, and like, ‘Carl gets shot in the face.’ Huh? This has got to be some sort of sick joke.
But there were so many sort of first things… I didn’t really have a sense of it, of like, oh, well, Scott would also tell me if things weren’t going well, but I’ve got a relationship with my son, I’ve got a relationship with a partner, I’ve got a relationship with a boss, I’ve got [indicates Leah] another nutter, [indicates Leah and Alexej] another two nutters. And so it was “slowly catchy monkey” for me.
But my wife was like, what the hell is going on with you? So I would go home at the weekends and I, via all the sort of stressful job and the PTSD and everything else, a fraction of osmosis occurred and I might not have been my normal rosy self.
Rob Bullock
You like to immerse yourself in the role.
Matthew Goode
She told me that things were cooking, I think, and that I needed to calm down.
Rob Bullock
Scott. So you are a writer and a director. Isn’t that just greedy? You know, why not just write? Why direct as well?
Scott Frank
Because two reasons. Why would I let someone else direct it if I wrote it?
Matthew Goode
So trust issues.
Scott Frank
Trust issues. Control issues, as my wife would say. No, mostly because it’s like, why would someone just want to be a co-pilot? You know? I feel like that it’s hard enough to express yourself. Movies are so collaborative. You’re telling your story through a hundred people, a hundred different artists. And I always describe it, it’s like you’re trying to pick a lock with a wet noodle. It’s very hard to get it done.
And I think that… As a writer I’ve worked with great directors in my career, I was very, very lucky. But you got to the point where you would just, the best you could hope for is you respected what they did. And almost always I respected what they did, but I had a very different thing in my head. And then when I started directing, I learned very quickly that the best I could hope for is that I just respected what I did because it was very different than what I had started with in my head. Eventually the bar became ‘I just don’t want to be embarrassed’, but that’s another conversation.
But you decide you wanna make the compromises because it is a show or a film or anything you’re directing is ultimately the sum of these compromises you have to make every day. So I wanted to be the one making them. And with television, there’s this very strange thing that happens. And I never came up through television. I don’t know how to do television. I shoot these, whether it’s this show or Godless or Mr. Spade, they’re all shot like movies for the most part. And then they get cut sometimes differently than how they are in the scripts, the way that happens in a movie. That’s how I think of it. And so I would rather shoot by location than by episode, because that’s how I was trained.
And I wonder… My central relationship is with an actor. And so I don’t understand how an actor can have a different director every hour of a 12 or 13 or episode show. I don’t know, at a certain point the actors start directing themselves, and that’s probably better because the directors who are coming in are not necessarily working from the inside out the way I think a good director should be.
So I tried to let someone else direct the first season of this, as again, I came on and ended up writing them all and directing most of them last time for all sorts of reasons. But I didn’t like it. I couldn’t do it. And my wife said to me before we started, oh, so you’ll just be directing them all. And I said, no, no, no, no.
So that’s pretty much why I just can’t do it. I just don’t know how to. I can’t let someone else do it.
Rob Bullock
So with this sort of total…
Matthew Goode
And we should be so lucky, by the way, because this is surely where we have to get into ‘adaptation of book’, and because they are quite different from the books.
Rob Bullock
Well, that touches on what I was going to say.
Matthew Goode
Sorry, I didn’t mean to mess with your mojo.
Scott Frank
Would you like to trade seats?
Rob Bullock
With this total creative control that you enjoy, what did you know you had to get right in episode one, knowing that everything else depended on it, going across the rest of the series?
Scott Frank
Well, we’ve talked about this—you and I—a lot. I think the best mysteries, there’s two things. One, the whodunnit is not as important as the whydunnit, because everyone’s reading, trying to guess who did it. And I’d say, there were times where we’d be talking as I was writing the scripts, and you’d say, don’t you think you’re giving it away? And I would say, let ‘em guess. Because they may get ‘I knew it was that person’, but they’ll never get it, they’ll never know why. Which is always more satisfying.
Chinatown, which is a perfect mystery. It’s the ‘she’s my sister, she’s my daughter’. That’s way more interesting than John Huston being the bad guy, if you will. So, character… You want people to be, the only way you can get to that, to a kind of emotional solution to a mystery is through really good characters. And so the idea is, and I get accused of taking too much time in pilots or first episodes, but I want you to know the characters. Because if you know them, then you’ll actually feel something at the end of the show, if you really get to know them.
And each episode is a little movie for me anyway, so you want to feel something at the end of each episode as well, and that requires a real character investment as opposed to getting to the end and simply understanding how you’re supposed to feel. They’re very… they’re two very different things.
So the goal of the first episode is just investing everybody in the show. And then just on a purely crass level, the second most important scene in your first episode is the beginning and your absolutely most important scene in the first episode is the end. Beyond that, I’m just trying to think how can I bring you into these people?
Rob Bullock
Matthew.
Matthew Goode
Yes…?
Rob Bullock
At the read-through, I remember that you had memorised both scripts in their entirety. You were completely off the page, which is…
Matthew Goode
The first two episodes?
Rob Bullock
Yeah, the first two episodes. And I’ve never seen that at a read-through before. So I’m just curious, this level of intense prep, is that really important to you? What is your process?
Matthew Goode
Well, because, I suppose because it was also working with Scott again, And, you know, Queen’s Gambit was quite good. But there’s an element of when you’re stepping in to being number one, it’s quite nice to scare the shit out of the rest of the cast.
And in a really good way, because it’s like, because I remember once… There’s a wonderful Irish actor called Anthony Boyle, who’s all sorts of wonderful trouble, and I adore him. And I remember we were doing some Agatha Christie something or other, and most of us had walked into the Irish Centre, having a pint and a cigarette, and then we went and sat down, and he was sort of a bit off book. And you could just see all the other actors start going, start looking through their script, because it was just a read-through, but he was brilliant.
And so that sort of slightly rubbed off on me a bit, but it was also due to the challenging nature of our schedule. And I sort of, I think at which point we had that, and I knew that I would be scuppered if I didn’t know quite a lot of the scenes.
Kate Dickie
You’re a great number one, you really are, because number one in the call sheet is a funny thing. And a lot of people don’t really understand it properly, as in you’re a lead role, there could be a lot of perks or whatever, but actually the number one, the role is like you lead by example. And the way you are on set and the way you approach your work and the way you envelop. I’ve seen Matthew turn up, knocking on trailer doors, or people are coming in to do a day, having a scene with him, maybe a few lines, welcoming. You’re a brilliant…
Matthew Goode
I was going in to steal their money, but unfortunately they were in there…
Kate Dickie
I’ve seen you leave them with watches and all that. But it’s a really important thing. It’s way beyond of what it looks like on paper than it does, if you lead by example. You’re number one, so on it, in that it just makes everyone step up. And you’re great at that. You really are. You really are.
Matthew Goode
Well, thanks. Love you.
Rob Bullock
Alexej, you’ve been described as a heartthrob.
Alexej Manvelov
As what?
Rob Bullock
You’ve been described as a heartthrob. I imagine this has been quite hard for you.
Alexej Manvelov
It’s unbearable. It’s, ah…
Rob Bullock
But in all seriousness, when I think about Akram, the thing that I think of most is stillness. And I’d love you to talk about that and how—
Matthew Goode
Stillness, laziness. It’s completely up to you.
Scott Frank
Interchangeable.
Rob Bullock
I would love you just to talk a bit about that and how you found that.
Alexej Manvelov
Well, it’s going to sound boring, but it’s the function of the character. He has to be a contrast to Carl, who’s insane. So Akram has to be secretly insane. But on the surface, he looks calm and ready to drop bombs. He’s mind’s spaghetti, his mom’s spaghetti.
What was the question? Stillness. Alright. That was a contrast to Matthew’s character, but also they all deal with trauma. I think that’s the thing they have in common, but they do it in different ways. And this is a facet of a person who already kind of think that he already dealt with that trauma. He’s all cried out, he’s all done, and now he’s being the stable point of gravity for the rest of the group. But of course, inside he is raging.
Matthew Goode
And what’s great is, but there’s a level of mystery about you.
Alexej Manvelov
Thank you.
Matthew Goode
I mean, in general. In general, darling. But yeah, and so this is what’s so interesting about season 2, is you suddenly start getting scripts and you’re like, oh my god, Akram! You start finding out about Akram and you’re just like, awesome. So you’re going to really, for those of you who like the show, you’re in for an absolutely treat. He’s a cross-dresser. No.
Alexej Manvelov
Don’t spoil it.
Scott Frank
And you’re going to be upset when he dies. But other than that…
Rob Bullock
Leah, this is your biggest role to date. I remember your first scene when you came into Department Q and you dropped the box on Carl’s desk. How did you feel that day?
Matthew Goode
She said she was nervous. I didn’t see it. I didn’t see it at all.
Leah Byrne
Are you joking?
Matthew Goode
Yeah. I didn’t.
Leah Byrne
I think that first scene I did, I had about four lines, right? I spent about two weeks every day drilling those four lines over and over again. And this was me being like, look at me being the perfect actor. I’m going to try it this way. I’m going to try it that way. Oh my god, look at all these ideas I’ve got. I’m amazing.
I walked in on the first day. I shat myself completely. I remember Matthew giving me a hug just to say hello and I remember just gripping on for dear life, like, oh my god. Forgot all my lines, obviously. Forgot them.
Matthew Goode
She was great. She was absolutely great.
Leah Byrne
We got there in the end. I was doing too much as well. It was just, it was just anxiety. It was just, you know, terror, sheer terror. But I just remember Scott pulling me aside at the end and just being like, look, just like learn the lines and say them. And see someone just giving me permission to just like learn the lines.
Matthew Goode
So you were doing double acting, you were on double duty because I didn’t see the nerves. All I remember really from our first day was I was trying to convince, I was trying desperately to convince Scott that I should be allowed to call you a bellend. And he was like, no, it’s, that’s punching down. I’m like, no, it’s funny.
Leah Byrne
It is funny, I would have liked that.
Matthew Goode
Yeah, not her, I mean the character. Yeah.
Rob Bullock
Kate.
Matthew Goode
Didn’t happen.
Rob Bullock
When I think about Moira, I think about spiders and swearing. And apparently both of these came from you. Could you talk to us a little bit about how that collaboration with Scott happened?
Kate Dickie
So I had a… I am a very big fan of the swear language. And I feel it’s a language that needs to be kept alive and mined well. So in various conversations I had with Scott over the preceding time to us shooting, effing and blinding, and getting really enthusiastic and effing and this and that, and slowly Moira’s language just got more flowery and more flowery and more Fs and stuff.
Which is great because this is what’s the beautiful thing about the way you write, Scott, is the longer he spends time with you as a person, the dialogue just suits the way you speak. So when you come to learn the dialogue, it’s like it’s for you.
So because a lot of the time as an actor, you can have real struggles with the way things are written a bit and trying to make it sound like you. And we just don’t have that with Scott because he kind of immerses himself around us and really listens. So Moira became quite a swearer.
The spider thing was, oh god, why did I do it? But anyway, I like to write kind of backgrounds and oh god, poor Scott. I wrote [and] sent off this big background about Moira’s past and how this and that. But in it I said, oh, she could be arachnophobic because just someone as a boss like that, having a little, just a little thing that you can’t control, a fear that I couldn’t.
Moira could be in a room with anyone, and if that spider came, she wouldn’t be able to cope. And so Scott kind of pounced on that a bit, and so Moira became arachnophobic as well, which I genuinely am a really bad arachnophobic.
Matthew Goode
This is a terrible time of year for you.
Kate Dickie
Oh, it’s terrible. I’ve had to move lodgings. I would literally push your granny over a cliff to get that. I mean, it’s terrible. It’s terrible. So I just thought it’d be interesting for Moira to have something that she couldn’t control because she is very much in control and it’s just interesting, isn’t it, when people have little foibles and things. So that’s how it came about.
Rob Bullock
So the show came out, it went straight to #1 globally and it stayed in the top 10 for weeks and tens of millions of people have watched it worldwide. Who here wants to have a stab at saying how, why did it connect the way that it did? Why do you think it cut through?
Matthew Goode
Why look at me? I mean, the show’s creator should be the person to ask that.
Alexej Manvelov
Sounds reasonable.
Scott Frank
I never think anything is going to cut through. I never think anything is going to work or be good, so I choose to be pleasantly surprised rather than violently disappointed. And so I never know. I don’t know why.
Matthew Goode
I suppose there are the books.
Scott Frank
There are the books.
Matthew Goode
So that helps us.
Scott Frank
But I can’t tell you. I wish I knew because then I could do that over and over again. But I think just sometimes when you’re telling a story, the story is true to itself. And the story is told from the inside out. The story is told by characters and people get into the characters and they want what they want. And then the sort of sugar is a mystery and thriller and other kinds of genre things that go with it.
Matthew Goode
And also they shoved ‘from the creator of Queen’s Gambit’ onto it. So people were like ‘I might give that a watch’.
Kate Dickie
And it’s also got to do with the fact of the rich, rich characters you do, because even… You talk about small characters, but when you’ve got really great characters written as main, but then you’ve got the kind of surrounding stuff not as mined and well written, it’s really hard to get immersed.
And I think you create really because you are so character driven and there’s like richness and like a wholeness to these, you’re not just flat on a page. You get involved, you get immersed, you know, you start to care. And whether it’s chess or whether it’s detectives or whether it’s, you know, it’s like you create worlds that are just, you just care about. And I think that’s what comes from great—
Matthew Goode
There’s not many people, there’s not been that many amazed, and this is… We’re at a literary festival, so you’ll understand, but within our world, there’s not many great writers, if we’re really honest. And this is going to be an awkward moment for you. But we are also hoping for a raise for season 3.
Scott Frank
Season 2 is going to be okay. It’s fine. You’ll enjoy it. You can fold your laundry while you’re watching it.
Matthew Goode
No, but it’s true. And there’s probably, you know, like over here in England, you say Steven Knight or whoever, but there’s probably ten of you that you would get excited if you opened a script and you go, woohoo, it’s Scott or whoever, or the other ten. And that’s it in the entire world for me, certainly in the English language anyway.
Rob Bullock
Certainly, what Kate was saying as well, we do a thing with Netflix. When they have a new show coming out, they put it through quite a lot of audience research. And I don’t think you sat in on it. I think you were like, no, no, that’s too terrifying.
But I sat in and listened to people talking about the show, and it really chimed with what you were saying, because they were sort of saying, yeah, sure, I want to know why Merritt Lingard is being held in that chamber, and sure, I want to know why the people are holding her and whether she’s going to be okay. But what I really wanna know, is Carl going to stop being such a dick to Akram? Is that relationship going to sort of blossom? Is Rose going to find the courage to step up? How is Moira going to manage this sort of bag of cats she’s got to manage.
Kate Dickie
Team Doolally.
Rob Bullock
People really loved the characters and that’s what they wanted to—
Matthew Goode
I know, but I always say, because it’s an adaptation, but also Scott’s changed so much. There’s been times when you’re reading and you go, where did that come from? And he’ll just say something really annoying, like, you know, I just sit there and I just make, I get two people in a room and I make them talk to each other. And you’re like, yeah, alright genius, fine. If that’s the way you’re going to play it, okay. But it’s true, and it makes our job so much easier.
I mean, there’s two ways you can come about at a character. One is, there’s so much already there for you on the page. Or you could, so you have all your sort of given circumstances, et cetera, et cetera. So with Scott, it’s just, with Scott, I genuinely think you could go the Peter Brook “The Empty [Space]” way, as in the idea, the sort of philosophy of like, you could get on stage and just start saying the lines. And if he’s done his job so well, we would read everything without us having to do any work.
Now we did do all the work and give ourselves all these backstories and everything else, but I swear with his work you could do, but I wouldn’t, but then you wouldn’t have your sort of suit of armour of, you know, that you could get to go to work in.
Rob Bullock
Thank you. So look, I’m keeping an eye on the clock. I really want to give time for questions because I know people will have them. But very quickly, maybe Scott, what can you tell us about season 2?
Scott Frank
Nothing. It’s shit.
Matthew Goode
Wasn’t there a meeting? I remember you saying, we just went into Netflix and we’re just going to pitch. I don’t know what I’m doing here. We just went to Netflix and we just had a little pitch of season 2 and you said, and Scott was genius. I mean, you wouldn’t think you’d need to after, but you had to go in. And what was it he said again?
Rob Bullock
Well, Scott said, before we start talking about season 2, I just want to have a conversation about season 1, and I would love to hear from you what it was that you thought was really successful and what you really loved about season 1.
And so Netflix spent sort of 20 minutes talking about the show and how it was great, and Scott said, well, season 2, I’m just going to do more of that. It was masterful.
So, all right, look, we’ve got 15 minutes. Should we turn the lights up and get a roving mic? And who would like to get the ball rolling with a question? There is somebody right down there. Is there a mic? There’s somebody right down here at the front. Third row. In the middle.
Audience Member
The thing that I found really interesting is how I think locals on social media got so invested after watching it, going, she would never have gone up that way to get to the city chambers or that bus wouldn’t have gone that way. And I just thought that was really funny. How just people… And you probably not, as you said, not having been to Edinburgh before, do you find that coming into season 2, were there areas you were thinking, oh, that will be good for this scene and that will be good for that, you couldn’t use?
Scott Frank
Yeah, a lot. And by the way, when she went up to the chambers, I walked the way she would go and I went, oh, this isn’t good. There’s nothing cinematic about this. I want her to come out, Advocate’s Close, and there’s the church and there’s the this. She’s not going to go over there and come up that other place. So, I mean, it’s tricky because there are always things I’ve seen and things you discover. We shot a little bit in Aberdeen this time up that way. We’ve shot a lot out of Edinburgh this time, but a lot of the shows on sets.
But I live in New York now, but I lived in Los Angeles for a long time and I wrote a novel set in Los Angeles and I’d lived there 30 years or something. And a reviewer said, clearly Scott Frank knows nothing about Los Angeles. Because sometimes even visually, you’re going to make changes to just have it be a little more pleasing. And my dad, who was an airline pilot, could never enjoy any show with pilots on them because they’re saying, come in, please. Nobody ever fucking says, ‘Come in, please.’ And stuff like that.
And so, yeah, I’m always on the make for something new. Every time I go for a walk in the city or I’m driving back from set, I want to shoot everything and everyone. I’m constantly seeing things. And then you kind of think, well, what story thing could happen there? But yeah, I know, we’re not always so accurate. Why is she sitting in the park down there in the cemetery just to have to walk all the way up to court? Because it’s great. The castle’s above her head. The castle’s not above her head outside the courthouse. It’s a car park.
Rob Bullock
Very good. Who’s next?
Matthew Goode
It was nice filming in the summer as well.
Rob Bullock
There’s somebody over there with the glasses. Oh no, look, there we go. Nice and close. Yeah. And then maybe that gentleman there on the right, on the far side by the door.
Audience Member
First of all, absolutely love the show. Second, I actually live in Leith, so I love the fact that Leith is kind of like got an international flavour now. What made you choose Leith and is as the kind of area where Carl lives and have you had a chance to, for the actors, have you had a chance to explore the area at all? Is there any particular place that you actually like? Or don’t like?
Matthew Goode
It was very near the studio. I mean, that was one of the reasons I think that they chose, and also appropriate and on the green. I don’t know why, you chose the actual setting for the flat.
Scott Frank
Someone said to me, how about Leith? I said, let’s go look at Leith, whatever that is. And I went, yeah, that looks good.
Matthew Goode
There’s a very nice pub just by the studio as well. What’s the name of the pub? Does anyone remember? It’s had a refurb. I fully recommend it. I very rarely get to go, but I went in the other night and it was fabulous. And there’s a very nice…
Alexej Manvelov
Fisher’s.
Matthew Goode
…David Lloyd gym down in Leith. Which, as you can see, I haven’t been utilizing as much as I should.
Scott Frank
Sometimes it’s best not to know how the sausage is made.
Rob Bullock
Before we go to that gentleman there, hold the mic, but I gather we’ve got an online question which is very exciting. Andy, which country is this from and what’s the question?
Staff Member
We do. We have Vergas watching from Greece who says: With the heaviness of the themes in the show, how does the panel balance great humour when working through long shoots?
Kate Dickie
Because we like each other.
Leah Byrne
I know we do.
Kate Dickie
We do like each other a lot.
Leah Byrne
It’s like, honestly, when people ask me about, has it been like an intense schedule? And you’re like, yeah, it’s a lot of work, but it feels like coming to work with your pals every day. Like, I think that’s the joy of it. Everyone’s so nice and friendly and happy to be here. So yeah, it’s quite easy to be quite happy.
Matthew Goode
There’s a lot of levity flying around.
Leah Byrne
Yeah.
Matthew Goode
So it tends to be the darker the material, the more you sort of have a try and have a bit more of a giggle, I don’t know.
Leah Byrne
Totally, yeah.
Kate Dickie
Yeah, we just have a laugh, really, don’t we?
Alexej Manvelov
We have a playful set, I feel.
Leah Byrne
Yeah, it’s very playful.
Matthew Goode
And we’ve got the whole crew and they’re great. They’re very fun bunch as well. We can’t say enough about that.
Audience Member
So one of the things that really attracted me to Dept. Q is how it looked. I love the Dept. Q setting. I think it’s brilliant. How does it compare, like being your big things like Watchmen and Game of Thrones? How does it compare to Dept. Q?
Matthew Goode
That’s a really interesting question.
[The audience member is asked to repeat the question because the mic didn’t pick it up for the online audience.]
Matthew Goode
Ask it again.
Audience Member
So what I was saying was that one of the things that attracted me to Dept. Q is how it looks. I think the Dept. Q set looks amazing. But how does it compare to, you know, you worked on Watchmen, Game of Thrones, Logan, you know, all these kind of big Hollywood movies. How does it feel working on Dept. Q? Does it feel smaller? Does it feel bigger?
Kate Dickie
I mean, it’s so, the sets are beautiful in Dept. Q, aren’t they? And it would be strange to be on a massive set when it doesn’t call for that. So it’s just a right set. I mean, the detail is in there…
Matthew Goode
It’s not a small set.
Kate Dickie
It’s not a small one. I mean, you’re in the bullpen, it goes really high up, you know, you’ve got this big high ceiling. But all the details are amazing, down to like what’s on the boards, like even in Moira’s office, all the files, like all the things. I mean, the props and who do the decoration are incredible. I was sitting reading stuff that nobody will ever see. Pages of stuff, folk have been arrested, you know, the height, the weight, all the details, it’s brilliant.
Matthew Goode
All the riot costumes and stuff that are in the doors and stuff that we’ve never even used, that never get seen.
Kate Dickie
Yeah, things that you never see. But so I think you can’t really compare in size but in detail and the way it’s been constructed. Beautiful, like top notch.
Matthew Goode
Grant Montgomery is a genius. There’s no question.
Rob Bullock
Grant Montgomery. He is a very fabulous man.
Scott Frank
He is amazing.
Matthew Goode
But also, a lot of times when you’re working on those really big ones, by the way, that’s put in later. You often come out and you’re like, oh, what you see the final product is something vast and brilliant, and we go to work and there’s a whole load of blue up. So what’s so nice about art is everything is tangible. What you see is what is there. But Grant, this is like the sixth time I’ve worked with him, and he really is absolutely top of his game.
Rob Bullock
Somebody from this side of the room, I feel like I’ve, you know, here we go, a lady in the glasses there. Sorry, yeah, him and then the lady here in the black glasses.
Audience Member
Scott, you’ve made two shows for Netflix that have a ton of nuance and subtext, and they have a reputation for not always wanting that. Do you just say, I’m Scott Frank and I’m going to make what I want? Do you negotiate something? How have you managed to make the Queen’s Gambit in Dept. Q at Netflix?
Scott Frank
That’s what I do in every part of my life. That’s why I’ve been married so happily for 38 years. I just say, honey, I’m Scott Frank and I get what I want. And she says… No, my experience with them, you know, Godless was their very first in-house miniseries. And they… Cindy Holland, who was then running the show then, she said, we’re going to agree on all the kind of parameters, and we love the show, we’re going to tell you what you think, but we trust you. We’re hiring you and giving you all this money because we trust you.
And the same thing happened on Queen’s Gambit. They never… The subtlety, the nuance, they would say, this might be a little long, it might drag here, but they never forced me to do anything as far as I can remember. And so my experience with them has been so far, and here with Netflix Britain with Anne Mensah, who runs the show here, I mean, working on this show has been, again, for a show I didn’t intend to do much of anything on, has been one of the best experiences I’ve ever had.
And they don’t… I think there’s a lot written about Netflix. You know, they change the lighting, there’s “Netflix lighting”, there’s this, none of that’s true. You know, if a show’s lit like crap, it’s because the director and the cinematographer lit it like crap. No one upstairs is saying, light it like crap. Keep it really light. They just don’t.
And so I think that… If the material is doing what it’s supposed to do, and you have the conversation that people never seem to have, which is the one about intention, where everybody agrees on the intention. And if everybody agrees on the intention, it’s a much easier process. Then you’re just fighting about budget and time and how long it takes to achieve that intention. But they’ve been great.
But I am going to start trying that after this. It’s going to be a lot different on set from now on.
Alexej Manvelov
That’s how you direct. That’s exactly how you direct.
Scott Frank
There’s a new sheriff in town.
Rob Bullock
There was a lady here with black glasses, just their hand up.
Audience Member
I’m just interested to know if you could work with one actor who has deceased, who would it be and why?
Scott Frank
Steve McQueen. Because he’s still, he makes you lean in. So I write everybody for Steve McQueen. Men, women, children, they’re all babies, they’re all Steve McQueen.
Rob Bullock
Actually, I’ve got a quick question for you, Scott, which I realize I didn’t ask you, which is I heard a phrase here for the first time two years ago called plotters and pantsers, people who like to plot when they write or people who fly by the seat of their pants. So are you a plotter or are you a pantser?
Scott Frank
Well, seeing as you’ve been waiting for the last episode for six months for me to finish writing it, and seeing as we started shooting last season with two episodes written, and we were basically building the airplane while we were flying it. I am definitely a pantser. Definitely a pantser.
Rob Bullock
I concur, yeah.
Matthew Goode
But he’s also smokeless as well.
Rob Bullock
Exactly, yeah. It’s a bracing ride. Right, who’s next? Who’s got another question?
Scott Frank
This woman right here has had her hand up since the beginning. Four in right there.
Rob Bullock
Which one?
Scott Frank
Right here. I only know the people who are right here. That’s all I’m looking at.
Audience Member
I’ll sit down again so that people can see. First of all, I guess this answers the question like why does the show resonate with people? As a viewer, I can say it’s been a long time since I’ve watched anything that has gripped me the way that Dept. Q has. And it’s because it’s very nuanced. The writing has a lot of details and you can go back and watch the episodes multiple times. I’ve written recaps of it and every time I discover something new. So hats off to you, Scott. Hats off to everyone for making these characters, bringing them to life the way that you have so that they really resonate with us.
And my question… bear with me… is I spent my 50th birthday this year in January actually going to Edinburgh and looking at some of the locations that you’ve used in series 1. Drove around a lot, walked around a lot, was very, very interesting to see the city that way. And my question is, for all of you, do you have any location that means something to you where you have an interesting story or something that resonated with you?
Kate Dickie
Well, Moira didn’t really leave the office much in season 1. However…
Scott Frank
That was contractual.
Kate Dickie
I did get a really exciting helicopter lift. I didn’t have a location, but I did have a really exciting couple of hours where I sat in a helicopter, and that was fun. But Moira was in the office a lot, kind of keeping it in control in there.
Scott Frank
You do go to her flat this season.
Kate Dickie
Yes, you may see a little of my home life.
Scott Frank
Anyone else? Wow.
Alexej Manvelov
I don’t remember.
Scott Frank
Clearly they had the same experience you did.
Matthew Goode
That was two years ago.
Rob Bullock
Okay, I think we’ve got time for one more online question, I gather, which…
Staff Member
We do. Both Susan from California and Elizabeth from New York State just ask, is Kelly MacDonald making a return?
Scott Frank
She’s making another show. She’s doing Lanterns, so our show and their show couldn’t make it work. But she may come back. We never know. Depends on how her career is going on the other show.
Rob Bullock
We’ve got 20 seconds, so should we squeeze one more in? Oh, a hand shot up there. Let’s just do that one.
Audience Member
Just a last question for Bloody Scotland. Did you guys enjoy the book? The first book. Or the series.
Matthew Goode
That is a great question. And I’ve been waiting for this. Eagerly, to be at a literary festival and to be able to say no. Because our director told us not to. Because we were gonna change it, and that’s why it’s a shame we didn’t get to talk about adaptation. But that’s what you get with Scott. It is a brilliant adaptation, I hear. And we did the same with season 2, so should be an absolute belter.
Thanks so much for coming.
If you’d like to read my personal account of the event, I have put up a post about it here.
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